Lost in translation
- 2016-06-01
- By ReimaginingEurope
- Posted in Baines, EU Referendum
“A man who speaks three languages is called trilingual. A man who speaks two languages is called bilingual. A man who speaks one language is called English.”
That was a joke I saw on Twitter recently. But, it made me laugh only ironically. How British is that?
It also reminded me of the late ex-Chancellor of West Germany, Helmut Schmidt, who, in his book Ausser Dienst (Out of Office), advised Germans thinking of standing for election to the Bundestag not to do so unless they speak at least two foreign languages to a competent degree. His reason? You can’t understand your own culture unless you look at it through the lens of another culture - and to do that you need to know something of that other culture’s language. After all, some things cannot be translated; they have to be intuited. Language has to be inhabited, not just weirded as a functional tool.
When I related this to a famous English politician in a TV studio a few years ago, he laughed and said we wouldn’t have any politicians in Parliament if we applied that. I didn’t think it was funny.
It does say something about the insular nature and perspective of the debates raging currently about the European Union Referendum. Not only are the British - the English in particular - generally useless at learning the languages of even our nearest neighbours, we also seem to wear our ignorance as a badge of honour. But, it means that we don’t understand or care how we are seen by those beyond us. After all, unless they tell us in our language and on our terms, then we can’t even understand what they are saying.
This seems pertinent to one element of the current debate. Brexiters speak as if the UK could leave the EU, forge trade (among other) agreements with other countries on our own terms and with promised outcomes that suit our aspirations. Yet, this ignores the fact that at least two parties are involved in such dialogues, and they might not agree to the terms we think are essential for our benefit. Agreements cannot be guaranteed ahead of negotiations in which we are only one party.
Now, this is not to say we shouldn’t leave the Union or that we wouldn’t be able to make better deals than we currently have. But, it is to say that the other parties with whom we wish to deal independently of the EU will also have their own priorities, preferences and political sensibilities, and that they will see us through a different lens from that through which we see ourselves.
It is not enough to laugh at the Germans who wonder why we are even asking the question about leaving the EU. At least we should try to understand why they wonder. We might then disagree intelligently. You really do have to look through the eyes of our neighbours - in their terms and in their languages - to realise just how insular our own political language and discourse are.
It can only be hoped that the level of debate and intelligent discourse can be raised before 23 June. A decision to remain or leave should at least be informed and based on an assessment of risk, benefit and hope; but, the current trading of untestable assertion and personal ridicule - looked at in astonishment by some of our neighbouring media - simply reinforces outside perceptions of just how impoverished our political discourse has become.
Language learning in England is dire and does not look likely to improve in the short or medium term. The consequences are further reaching than mere jokes on Twitter.
About the author
Nick Baines is the Bishop of Leeds (for the Diocese of West Yorkshire & the Dales). He was previously Bishop of Bradford (2011-14), and before that was Bishop of Croydon. He read German and French at Bradford University and, before ordination, worked as a Russian linguist at GCHQ. Nick Baines became a member of the House of Lords in 2014. He has represented the Archbishop of Canterbury at international faith conferences and is the English Co-chair of the Meissen Commission which develops relationships between the Church of England and the Protestant Church in Germany.
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Spot on, Bishop Nick. For those who want to know Britain’s realistic options I suggest downloading (for free) an excellent, sober book by the Centre for European Policy Studies (CEPS) which has been much praised.
PDF]Britain’s Future in Europe.pdf - Centre for European Policy Studies
https://www.ceps.eu/system/files/Britain’s%20Future%20in%20Europe_0.pdf
Britain’s Future in Europe.
Britain’s Future in Europe Revisited:
http://www.anglican.ink/article/national-day-prayer-time-dunkirk-1940
Shadrach, Meshach and Abed-nego replied to the king, “O Nebuchadnezzar, we do not need to give you an answer concerning this matter. “If it be so, our God whom we serve is able to deliver us from the furnace of blazing fire; and He will deliver us out of your hand, O king. “But even if He does not, let it be known to you, O king, that we are not going to serve your gods or worship the golden image that you have set up.”…
Daniel 3 16:18
Before they call I will answer.
Isiah 65:24
For if you keep silent at this time, relief and deliverance will rise for the Jews from another place, but you and your father’s house will perish. And who knows whether you have not come to the kingdom for such a time as this?
Esther 4:14
One of the sadder commentaries on the debate, I think. Even if we are not linguists (and I would say that trilingualism is a reasonable ambition for an educated person in a country that values its culture and that of its neighbours as contributing to that culture) then there is so much we can do to gain a perspective from Europe on our current debate. In fact, given the appalling level of public discourse currently reported on this debate (I really hope it goes deeper than we are being told), getting somebody else’s thoughtful perspective on the debate amounts to a civic duty. This website has been a lifeline in that respect.
The language issue is of course a whole other ballgame, and not properly addressed even by those who want us to remain in the EU.
Thanks, Nick, for another thought-provoking post.
Excellent, Nick - thank you. Your point about language learning as a key to seeing ourselves as others see us is exactly right.
If we leave the EU, UK students will no longer have access to Erasmus and Comenius programmes. My son, already trilingual (English, Hungarian and French), enjoyed a year near Heidelberg as a language assistant in a gesamtschule. He now teaches German and French in a Suffolk secondary school.
Your son has done well. Erasmus is most important for unifying the European military and policing. Not everyone knows this.
Sir
I always thought that Christians examined themselves by using the reference-point of texts in the Bible.
For example, ‘He also said to the crowds, “When you see a cloud rising in the west, you say at once, ‘A shower is coming.’ And so it happens. And when you see the south wind blowing, you say, ‘There will be scorching heat,’ and it happens. You hypocrites! You know how to interpret the appearance of earth and sky, but why do you not know how to interpret the present time?’
Luke 12 54-56
I understand that in the Church of England services based on The Book of Common Prayer are diminishing. In the wake of that, knowledge of the Articles of Religion is also on the decrease.
Do Anglicans know that they cannot vote to remain in the EU?
Article XXXVII: Of the Civil Magistrates states:
‘The Queen’s Majesty hath the chief power in this Realm of England, and other her Dominions, unto whom the chief Government of all Estates of this Realm, whether they be Ecclesiastical or Civil, in all causes doth appertain, and is not, nor ought to be, subject to any foreign Jurisdiction.’
It is difficult to believe after the struggle for Magna Charta (1215); the Bill of Rights (1688) and habeas corpus (a command to the State to ‘produce the body’ now extinguished by the European Arrest Warrant) that the British will yield to the unelected and unaccountable government of the EU (the Commission).
What was the point of your forefathers’ generations fighting tyranny?
Is the debate really about language, negotiation and what the neighbours say?
Or is it about freedom, security, liberty and democracy? Terms which men who sit in rat-infested prison cells (accused by the State) all over the world (in different languages) understand more deeply than the Briton who thinks nothing more of this monumental decision than that it’s a vote for a status quo. That it emphatically is not: the European Community; the European Economic Community; the European Union and tomorrow the United States of Europe.
If the British go down then it will be by their own hand. No Johnny-foreigner will have deceived them; no general will have defeated them; no fifth-columnist will have pushed them over the white cliffs of Dover.
The article referred to needs careful interpretation in historical context. It refers to the relationship between civil magistrates and the Church. It meant, very simply, that the monarch (then Elizabeth I), as sovereign, could not be subject in civil or religious matters, to the Pope (the ‘Bishop of Rome’). That is why the monarch is also ‘Supreme Governor’ of the Church of England, though many think the ‘Disestablishment’ of the Church is long overdue.
The New Testament should also be understood in the context of the century in which it was written, before being applied present-day concerns and circumstances.
In any case, my passport may have my European citizenship attested on its cover, but it still refers to me as HM’s subject. Even if the EU were a confederation, which it is not, this would still remain the case. This is not a referendum about sovereignty, simply about how and where decisions are made and resources pooled or shared.
Yes, yes, yes and adultery, fornication, incest and homosexuality ‘should also be understood in the context of the century in which it was written’.
Daft.
Lost in Translation
The above statements i find demeaning to those of us who are the workers of this nation who through our Christtian values pay our tax s put roofs on your churches pay into the coffers send aid abroad ,and give genrisoyly to those in need , our Christtian values sir are from our beloved Bible from the teachings of a book that has been translated !
So is your above statement Nick Bines saying to me that it’s all of no effect ! As the true meaning of what is written in our Bible has been lost in translation ? We have not all had the opportunity of a good education within the university’s ,and maybe if we had from what your saying ,and my limited understanding with being so ignorant of the set of languages that would prove I am a more enlightened being , there would be no need for any of us to go to church for guidance as we would no it all , where dose Lost in translation leave us with the Bible !
As for the debate on the EU many Germans are very disillusioned and angry with what has taken place on ground level ,if I may be so bold as to advise any of you that have had the luxury of a proper education you need to climbe out of your ivory towers get down with the workers the less educated and see for your selfs first hand what is really going on with your flocks , and no I don’t need to learn another language apart from being worked and tax to death ,my love of my Christ and His values His teachings through my heart tells me all I need to know it is through Him and only His word that I need ,Love has no language barrier and we can love Europe but have the sense to search for our selfs that the EU is a separate entity of which there are no Christein democratic values at all ,ultimate power should never be given to anyone that can not be held accountable ,you distance us loyal Bible followers with your lack of ability to talk through the language of Our savour love is his language as I interpret my Bible and that sir tells me everything ,the story of David & Goliath as far as the EU is concerned is what springs to mind I vote for OUT as do many of us workers on that basis ,may God be praised for His son who was crucified for our freedom to be born again unto Him be all the praise ,His love has no language barrier unlike your suggestion ,that we of the U.K. are ignorount insulated and beneath enlightenment on the subject of the EU !the Lord my God went to war on many occasions mostly with those who put them selfs above the common people the workers the slaves those of us that pray silently to be rescued from the greedy, power mad, enslavest undemocratic tyrants of this world the likes of the EU ,your language is foreign to me as I don’t heare the soft voice of Christ to His people through it maybe you need to relearn His language it’s one of protection of love for all .
Well said, Kim.
I am alarmed that a contribution from a Bishop has no reference to God or the Bible. This is no different from any secular argument. We need to implore God to bring revival to this nation so that once again we may return to our Christian roots. Some will say that we have already gone too far in the wrong direction, but I do believe in miracles. The EU has a completely different agenda; as many have said, its aim is the United States of Europe, in which we would completely lose our sovereignty.
Amen to that.
P:S: St Paul was both a subject of Judea, and a citizen of Rome. For him, there was no contradiction in serving and obeying the magistrates of both, even though Rome was an Empire controlling his homeland. Any authority the EU has over British subjects is itself subject to democratic control, either through our own Parliament, or our representatives in the European Parliament, so it is, in magisterial terms, ‘properly constituted’.
Oh please do explain then the persecution of Christians by States throughout history. Do tell us what Christian ‘martyrdom’ is.
Andrew, where is the democratic control?
The EU parliament, has no real power, it is a talking shop, which can not initiate legislation.
It can only vote on what is placed before it, by unelected commissioners, who have the power to ignore the vote, if it goes against them, & force legislation through.
It is therefore similar in powers to the Chinese & North Korean parliaments, who also have no real power.
Our own parliament, has no power over the legislation imposed on us, as the unelected commissioners, overrule our elected representatives.
So the EU is as properly constituted, as any other dictatorship!!!!
P:S
It all comes down to the simple FACT do we here in the UK want to be governed by an unelected foreign polices maker or do we want to be governed by our own democraticle elected prime minister ? That we can unelect when they fail us,
I for one find it distasteful that those who want to remain are discremanating against the rest of the world the EU is Not Europe it just uses the banner to hide behind its true nature , a self elected bunch of hyporcrets we are indeed in one of our darkest times , as predicted in end of days ,
We should be open to trade and help the whole world not just the chosen few within the EU
They were wrong about the euro they were wrong about the weapons of mass distraction and the government are wrong now , self serving putting self first is not a Christen value ,
Love the whole world not part of it ,
In God I trust not man and his self greed and agenders love Europe not the single minded biased EU .
Search your hearts do you love all peoples or just some !
I quite agree that the public debate about the referendum needs to be lifted out of its trough but that has nothing to do with our inability to speak more than one language.
It doesn’t matter how many languages the Germans learn, their government will still not understand why we want to leave the EU. I could state half a dozen reasons, without talking about immigration, why the UK is in a different place and going in a different direction to the Eurozone countries and as such it needs to leave before it damages itself and the Eurozone. ‘ A house divided against itself etc…..’
Can we all please calm down a bit? I have my views on the EU, and they may be right or they may be wrong (or God may see merit in both sides of the argument). Why is it that every post seems to include comments asking whether or not the EU is democratic (and let’s remember that there are valid arguments to say that it is and that it isn’t, as it the case with the UK’s system).
However:
Philippians 2:3 Do nothing out of selfish ambition or vain conceit. Rather, in humility value others above yourselves.
Philippians 3:15 All of us, then, who are mature should take such a view of things. And if on some point you think differently, that too God will make clear to you.
As Christians we are to disagree well, and to disagree in love. So please no more personal attacks and no more arrogantly having “the Christian answer”. Persuade me with facts, and back up those facts too. And let’s all pray that we as a country make the right decision in an informed way.
Philip, you say that there are valid arguments to say that the EU is democratic and, later, that you want to be persuaded by facts.
Well, for starters, would you pleae provide some facts of your own to back up this claim of yours?
Thanks Ian. I’m not saying that it’s a perfect argument, but a valid argument nonetheless. Here’s a quote from http://johnmccormick.eu/2014/05/three-of-the-most-persistent-myths-about-the-european-union/
“British critics of the EU like to argue that Britain is losing control to unelected bureaucrats in Brussels (by which they mainly mean the European Commission). While the senior staff of the Commission are indeed unelected, so are bureaucrats almost everywhere, including those in Whitehall. And those staff – as well as being appointed by the elected governments of the member states, and being subject to confirmation in their positions by the elected European Parliament, and having to report regularly to the EP – cannot make final decisions on EU law or policy. Those decisions are made by the Council of Ministers (consisting of ministers from the elected governments of the member states) and the elected EP. Furthermore, the general direction of the EU is guided by the European Council, consisting of the elected heads of government (or state) of the 28 EU member states. And all the EU institutions are accountable to the treaties and the European Court of Justice. The idea that there is a European government in Brussels with independent powers is nothing more than a myth.”
You only have to compare that with our unelected head of state, our unelected second chamber, our unelected bureaucrats, the fact that over 50% of Scottish people directly voted to remain in the UK and yet 5% of Scottish MPs were elected on a unionist basis.
Or to go further afield, in the USA the cabinet is nominated by the president subject to approval in the Senate, much like the European Commission who are subject to approval by the European Parliament.
People will want to come back on some of these points, and that’s no problem, but nevertheless it’s a valid argument.
‘While the senior staff of the Commission are indeed unelected’.
Why not tell them the truth that the Commissioners themselves are unelected - and they are the government of the EU. Tell them about Neil Kinnock and others. Why not tell them that the practice of democracy on the continent is a recent idea?
Tell them about the oaths Kinnock and others have sworn - don’t hide all that info?
You man (through link) is being paid for by the EU.
That’s a source paid for by the EU: he who pays the piper calls the tune.
Is this source, paid for by the EU, biased: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3535018/Why-Britain-never-wants-Europe-Seventy-times-tried-block-EU-laws-Seventy-times-failed-Euro-MP-DANIEL-HANNAN-lays-bare-impotence-Brussels.html ?